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0802 Minutes

The Community Council minutes summarized a Chinese Students' Association request for £300 in funding for a concert that was reduced to £100 for transportation of cultural items. A resident expressed concerns about work being done in South Street including damage to trees and the road alignment. Fife Councillors provided updates on various issues including repairs to the Martyr's Monument, changes to refuse collection, and work happening in South and Market Streets.

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0% found this document useful (0 votes)
75 views8 pages

0802 Minutes

The Community Council minutes summarized a Chinese Students' Association request for £300 in funding for a concert that was reduced to £100 for transportation of cultural items. A resident expressed concerns about work being done in South Street including damage to trees and the road alignment. Fife Councillors provided updates on various issues including repairs to the Martyr's Monument, changes to refuse collection, and work happening in South and Market Streets.

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jamesbor
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You are on page 1/ 8

St Andrews Community Council Minutes February 2008

http://www.standrewscc.net/standrewscc/2008/0802minutes.html

Royal Burgh of St Andrews Community Council DRAFT Minutes February 2008


For approval (Copies of Agendas and Minutes of the Community Council are held at Fife Council's Local Office, St Mary's Place and the Town Library, Church Square. Those from late 1997 on are on line at http://www.standrewscc.net/)

0. Vote on co-option of Community Councillors


The two remaining vacancies were voted on by Community Councillors. There were four candidates for the two vacancies: Carol Ashworth, received 14 votes, Mr Matthew Verrall, 6 votes, Ms Jenny Mackay 6 votes and Ms Aisling McKeown 3 votes. Ms Ashworth was invited to join the meeting. Following the meeting Mr Verrall was confirmed as the second co-option when Ms Mackay decided not to continue with her candidacy.

1. Attendance
Community Councillors
Ken Crichton, Alex Bain, Dave Finlay, Kenneth Fraser, Ian Goudie, Zoe Smith, Marysia Denyer, Karen Hutchence, Laurence Reed, Patrick Marks, Catherine Rowe, Judith Harding, Fiona Harden, Henry Paul, Rob Fett

Students' Association Representatives Nominated Fife Councillors


Francs Melville, Robin Waterston, Bill Sangster

Apologies
Matthew Guest, Cllr Morrison, Tom D'Ardenne, Shaun Atkinson, Jude Innes

2. Minutes of January 2008 Meeting


6.5. Mr Sangster pointed out an error. He noted that he could not have seconded any proposal being a non-voting participant. This was noted.

3. Presentation
3.1. Presentation by Xiaoqi Feng, the President of the Chinese Students and Scholars Association (CSSA) of the University of St Andrews with a request for funding assistance for a music concert at the Younger Hall.
Ms Feng gave a synopsis of the event being organised by her Association. A well-known Chinese musical group had agreed to perform at the Younger Hall. In order to help cover any gap in costs she was seeking funding assistance. She quoted the proposed ticket prices, and discussed the costs of putting on the event. The uncertainty to whether the sale of tickets could cover the costs, had led to the request for support. She asked for 300 in financial support to help cover any potential gap. This request was discussed later in the meeting. Doubts were expressed about supporting what is a commercial concert by the Silk String Quartet. A compromise was suggested with 100 being offered towards the cost of transporting to St Andrews a Chinese Dragon and lion, which the CSSA could use on Chinese New Year in St Andrews. Judith Harding proposed that 100 be donated towards this request, Catherine Rowe seconded the proposal. There was no dissent. 100 grant to be given to CSSA towards transport costs for dragon and lion.

3.2. South Street


Ms Uprichard gave a brief history of the attempts to narrow the road and widen the pavements in South Street. The first attempt had been in 2004, funded by Scottish Enterprise when there had been a plan to narrow the street, widen the pavements, put in street furniture and cut down the trees and replace them with smaller ones etc. This plan was the subject of a petition with over 1000 signatures and was turned down by Councillors by 13:3. Then last September work started again in South Street. She began to see damage to trees in the street, but when she enquired about the matter she was told that no planning permission was required to do work in the road. However planning permission is required for the lights and the street

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furniture. Last year, she reminded the Community Council that an official from Fife Council had outlined plans at the June 2007 Community Council meeting about upgrading work in South Street, but at that time planning permission hadn't been obtained. There was an indication that when a planning application was made there would be time for public representation, but this hasn't happened according to Ms Uprichard and neither she or Dr Goudie have seen plans for the work. When she complained about the treatment of the trees she had been told that there would be a meeting between officials and Regional Councillors, but as far as she was is aware this hasn't happened. More recently Ms Uprichard had noticed a considerable widening on the north side of the street almost opposite WH Smith. She phoned Transportation who informed her that the outcrop would be 2 feet further out, but in her estimation it is 4 feet. This has created a chicane, which in her assessment has blocked the alignment of the street on the north side, and in order to maintain the required 7-metre width for traffic, the pavement on the south side has been cut away, despite being only a few years old. Ms Uprichard then quoted from a report in relation to the trees affected by the work - The three trees encountered so far have endured some root damage and it is inevitable that further damage will occur as the process of repaving continues. It is not possible to continue the work intended without damage to tree roots due to the age and size of the trees etc Future tree growth is likely to be further compromised by the installation of the hard landscape features of which the galvanised tree grills are a significant part. In turn damage to the hard landscape features should be expected as tree roots and root collars expand year on year. In essence Ms Uprichard thought that the report was saying that tree roots would continue to damage the new paving and vice versa. Ms Uprichard ended by commenting, that the outcrop by Mackays had only taken two days to install and presumably would only take a similar time to remove.

4. Fife Councillors
4.1. Cllr Frances Melville
4.1.1 Strathkiness High Road Speed Limit
Residents in this area are to be consulted on possible speed restrictions such as speed humps and other markers. This follows residents of Strathkiness High Road approaching Councillors, to ask if similar markings to slow traffic as are being proposed at Lawhead School can be considered for Strathkiness High Road.

4.1.2. Strathcarron
Cllr Melville had been alerted to a lack of grit bins at Strathcarron despite its location. She had contacted the appropriate Fife Council Dept on the matter.

4.1.3. Town Centre Work


Cllr Melville had sent emails to the secretary of the Community Council to keep the Community Council up to date with progress. The secretary had forwarded Cllr Melville's email to members.

4.1.4. Future of Fife Park Halls of Residence


There is to be a meeting set up by the University to discuss the future of these Halls of Residence, which will involve local residents

4.1.5. Temporary change in parking arrangements by Tennis Courts


The small car park beside the tennis courts is being temporarily used by residents of Southgait Hall flats while their access is blocked by the town centre works. This sort of occasional short-term arrangement will take place as required.

4.2. Cllr Bill Sangster


4.2.1. Martyr's Monument Repairs
Cllr Sangster has been making enquires on this matter. The monument is showing considerable signs of wear, partly due to the nature of the stone and the effects of the elements since its erection. There is concern both for the state of the monument and the safety of the public. A fence has been put around the monument for public safety. Cllr Sangster is trying to pin down who is responsible for repair. The monument is probably on Common Good land. Ms Smith expressed concern that the fence would have a detrimental impact upon the town during judging for the Beautiful Scotland competition. Cllr Sangster acknowledged this concern. He felt that if the monument could at least be made safe, before

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major remedial work, then the fence might not be necessary at that time.

4.2.2. Public Meeting on Changes to Refuse Collection


A reminder about the Public Meeting on Refuse Collection in the area to be held on February 6th in the Town Hall.

4.2.3. Castle Beach Cleaning


Cllr Sangster reported that the beach was cleaned today and will be regularly checked in future, following regular concern about the mess left, particularly when parties take place. Mrs Denyer thanked Cllr Sangster about his work in getting cleaning organised for the Castle Sands. She had also received a letter from St Leonards, seeking to be involved in cleaning of a beach as part of voluntary work connected to the International Baccalaureate. Mrs Denyer had replied saying that she'd bring up the request/offer to the meeting. She had raised the issue of health and safety in her reply to the teacher organising this voluntary element of the IB. Cllr Sangster agreed that health and safety might be an issue. Ms Smith suggested that Mrs Denyer contact the teacher involved and suggest that she liaise with Jim Hootton of Fife Council.

4.2.4. Works on South Street


From 3rd March until work is finished, South Street will be one way going westwards, using Bell Street, Market Street and Church Street going eastwards. There has been a delay in completion of the Queens Gardens work due to cabling found just below the road surface, belonging to the university. Hopefully this will be finished by 24th February. Mr Finlay and Dr Goudie brought up issues of re-alignment in South Street, finding it curious that with the Post Office moving across the road that the greater pavement width wasn't on the WH Smith side. A lack of cycle parking was also noted on that side as well. Cllr Sangster commented that the road width wouldn't change. There would be more parallel parking and parking for disabled.

4.2.5. Market Street plans


Has been delayed in going out to consultation, due to ill health of one of the Council employees involved in organising the consultation process. He hoped that it would start soon.

4.2.6. Bandstand Concerns


Mr Reed asked Cllr Sangster about health and safety relating to the bandstand. It is showing signs of wear, due to its age, location and the materials of which it is made. He was concerned about possible problems arising unless some remedial action was taken to keep it in good order.

4.2.7. Common Good Land


Mr Finlay asked Cllr Sangster for any sign of progress in identifying Common Good land in the town. Cllr Sangster hoped that Fife Council would be able to do the work this year. Last year they'd been tied up with similar work in Cupar.

4.3. Cllr Robin Waterston


4.3.1. New Weekly Planning Lists
Cllr Waterston had asked why these weren't put on the Fife Direct web site. He'd received a reply that the additional work involved would take up too much of officials time. However a search on Fife Direct planning site using dates would bring up weekly lists. Mr Finlay also commented on the difficulty of dealing with the weekly planning documents as they were in PDF format and difficult to reformat for insertion in the CC agenda. He was also concerned that lists received by Dr and Mrs Goudie didn't always tally up with lists he downloaded, thus reducing confidence in what was being received. Cllr Waterston acknowledged that there was a problem with the lists, and asked Dr Goudie and Mr Finlay to give him examples which he could chase up. Dr Goudie commented on a need for improvement in the system to allow the Planning Committee to do its job properly.

4.3.2. Plastic Bag Free St Andrews


Linked to this according to Cllr Waterston is the Climate Change Bill being brought forward by the Scottish Government with very stringent emission reduction targets. Fife Council have set up a Carbon Reduction Board to see what it can do, with Cllr Waterston a member. He will keep the Community Council apprised of how the decisions taken by this board could affect St Andrews. Ms Harding commented about the Public library being the only place where one could leave plastic bags, but she wasn't certain what happened them. Cllr Waterston had not heard about this scheme, but was not aware of any company, which took in plastic bags to

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recycle.

4.3.3. Market Street


Cllr Waterston expressed his disappointment at the delay. However he felt that this might not prove to be such a bad thing as he'd received a letter about another matter, which tied in with any plans for Market Street. This was the Historic Conservation Area Appraisal Plan about which he'd received a letter from a Diane Barbery of Fife Council. He'd asked her how this might tie in with the general plans for Market Street as he was concerned that there could be some confusion and overlap. In reply she'd indicated that she'd been in contact with the planners and they would hope to work in conjunction. There would also be full public consultation.

4.3.4. 20 MPH Zone Decisions


Dr Goudie expressed concern about the procedure for setting up these zones. He felt that there appeared to be inconsistency in its application, citing an area in Strathkiness where there were only houses on one side of the road, while busy roads in St Andrews didn't have such zones. He was also concerned about the environmental benefits, following information from an AA report in which it was revealed that cars doing 20 mph were emitting more than cars doing 30 mph. Obstacles such as road humps could also create extra emissions. Dr Goudie questioned the basis of the Canongate decision, given that the issue had been around for a couple of years. He also suggested that any monitoring of the effectiveness of the decision, was flawed by the lack of a baseline on which to compare the data, from before and after the restrictions were in place.

4.3.5. Kinnesburn Flood Defences


Cllr Waterston acknowledged that the situation is somewhat confused. There had been an incorrect report in the Courier that flood defence work had been approved. There was a plan, but it hadn't been approved in Cllr Waterston's understanding. Cllr Melville said that there'd been an error in the press release. Clllrs Melville & Morrison have been trying to get a clear answer, as to whether anything can be done to clear silt, but have still to receive an authoritative reply from SEPA. Cllr Sangster added that the issue had gone back and forwards to SEPA who had eventually agreed that some clearance could take place, but funding is now problematic.

4.3.6. St Mary Street Sewage Problems


Mr Finlay asked about sewage problems, which in he felt could only worsen with plans to build more properties in St Andrews. Cllr Sangster replied that Scottish Water had the responsibility for clean water, and that perhaps we should ask for a representative from Scottish Water to come to talk to the Community Council. Mr Crichton wondered about the role of SEPA where there were problems. Cllr Waterston described their role as a statutory body and how they had to be consulted by Fife Council and Scottish Water for various types of work, which might have environmental impact. Mr Crichton thought that they would be interested if there was sewage being discharged into the harbour due to the problems with the sewage system. Cllr Waterston acknowledged SEPA's role in such a situation. Secretary to write to Scottish Water to ask to come and speak to CC.

4.3.7. Nominate Your Favourite Landscape in Fife


Mr Finlay raised this matter, concerned that the deadline for this consultation, which had been on the go since December, was the 8th February. He'd experienced difficulties with the web site, and the software required to download a form to use for making a nomination. He'd contacted an official about the matter and was told he could write in, but as he pointed out there wasn't an address on the web site to which nominations could be posted. Cllr Waterston felt that as the matter wasn't a planning application but a consultation, the deadline date could be extended. He also thought that there would be further consultations once draft proposals had been made. Cllr Waterston added that there hadn't been a review of landscapes in Fife for about 30 years, and it was probably an attempt to try and look again at the Areas of Great Landscape Value. He and his colleagues would resist any attempt to see this superseding the local plan consultation process. Dr Goudie suggested that one of the Councillors should try to provide a postal and or email address to aid anyone wishing to write in with their ideas.

4.4. Cllr Dorothea Morrison


Absent

5. Planning Committee
5.1. Minutes of Planning Meetings
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5.1.1. Objection to Old Course Hotel Planning Application


Mr Finlay commented that the reason for objection was the lack of information. They had received material in black and white, which didn't allow them to make a proper judgement about colours for window changes. Unfortunately the objection had gone in too late, and he'd been phoned by an official to advise him that the plans had already been passed. He felt that this was an occasion on which they'd not received the weekly plans. Dr Goudie wondered looking into the chronology of this decision, to determine exactly when the consent was granted and whether it was under delegated powers. He would have thought that normally officials should await the decision of the Community Council Planning Committee before giving consent.

5.2. Request for Access to a PC to view Planning Applications


Mr Finlay, wondered that given the lack of access to plans at times whether there might be any way to get access to a PC, to try and find plans online, to ensure there might be no future problems in getting objections in on time. Fife Council officials have admitted that they system is a bit of a shambles and needs sorting out. Cllr Sangster suggested speaking to Kate Hughes about access to a PC in the Local Office.

5.3. Fife Structure Plan


Mr Finlay sought clarification on the timescale for putting in comments to the Scottish Government, which he believed to be six weeks, which is about the middle of March. Cllr Melville in her response said that the Scottish Government could still modify any proposals about housing numbers. Mr Paul asked if the 1000 houses was the absolute total. Cllrs Sangster and Melville confirmed that it wasn't the total for the town, as other smaller sites could still be developed on top of the proposed 1000 houses which would probably be in the west of the town. Cllr Sangster reminded the meeting that the local plan allowed infill areas. Dr Goudie had come across a document, which had been modified to change the numbers of houses proposed from 1200 to 1000 within the western area. He'd also come across a document, which he assumed was the report from officials about strategic land allocation, which included the figure of 1000 houses within the western area of the town. These documents had been discussed at a meeting of Councillors in December. He wondered whether councillors could say which of the two documents had been approved. Cllr Waterston acknowledged that the 1000 houses didn't have a precise boundary around which they will be contained. The area will be decided within the context of local plan consultation and decision-making. He added that there was an expectation that development would be in the west. Dr Goudie in replying still wondered whether once the area was defined, whether it would be all 1000 houses, or a large percentage of that number according to which document was accepted. Cllr Waterston in reply to concerns raised by Dr Goudie about the clear definition of the area in which building would take place, said that the only time when there would be a guarantee would be after the local plan was finalised. He acknowledged that officials probably had a fairly clear idea of the boundaries of the area in which they would see building of the 1000 houses taking place. Cllr Waterston also acknowledged the difficulties and frustration felt in local communities, but commented that the structure plan would never produce clear boundaries. He and his fellow councillors would do their best to ensure that a proper process of master planning, which would encourage local community engagement would take place. He added that the lack of both a structure plan and local plan was very frustrating, but other issues such as the effect upon the landscape, infrastructure and the green belt etc still had to be determined through the local plan consultation process. Cllr Melville commented that at the end of the day, the Scottish Government could decide not to proceed with any it, and briefly commented on the unknown implications of the change to City Regions.

5.4. Land south of 78 Largo Road


Dr Goudie briefly commented on this matter. He was trying to determine what the real reason for the re-alignment of the access road was, before deciding whether to put in an objection, bearing in mind the legal agreement between Muir and the NHS to provide access within 4 years to the Southern Hillside across hospital land.

5.5. Street Furniture


Dr Goudie brought up the issue of the notice boards around the town, particularly in South Street and at Spar. The latter has disappeared, while the former has been removed during street work more recently. He had heard that the intention of Fife Council was to replace the South Street board with a much smaller one, which given the heavy use of the original board should be questioned. The board by Spar had, apart from the metal legs, had disappeared

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completely. Ms Smith confirmed that the Spar board had rotted away. Dr Goudie wondered whether the Hamada Trust still existed and if so would it be willing to fund new boards. Discussion about the replacement of the board at Spar ensued with a range of suggestions. Ms Smith proposed that quotes should be obtained for replacing the board at Spar. Mr Crichton suggested contacting Mr Peterson, as he had contact with a centre, which employed young adults with learning difficulties, who might be able to make a replacement board. Ms Smith agreed that Mr Peterson should be contacted to see if this idea might be viable.

6. Matters Arising From Previous Meetings


6.1. 50th Anniversary of the Freedom of the Royal Burgh of St Andrews for Bobby Jones
Mr Marks reported on the response from the Fife Council Chief Executive to his letter asking whether Fife Council would be in any way involved in commemorating this anniversary. The Chief Executive indicated that there would be no Fife Council official involvement from a central level, but suggested that Kate Hughes, Locality Officer would be willing to discuss some form of local commemoration in conjunction with the Community Council.

6.2. Finalised Fife Structure Plan: Housing Land Requirement Re-appraisal


For information only - see Planning Committee

6.3. Reports from Representatives


6.3.1. Town & Gown Liaison Committee
Ms Smith attended this committee on the 14th January. Nothing significant to report.

6.3.2. Cosmos Management Committee


Ms Smith attended this committee on the 21stJanuary. Issues to do with the leaking roof dominated the meeting. Approaches to Fife Council have been made with no success to date. The Bus appeal is going well.

6.3.3. University Liaison Meeting


Ms Smith attended a meeting about proposals for replacing Fife Park on the 24th January.

6.3.4. Homestart Meeting


On the 30th January Ms Smith met with Homestart. A presentation is to take place at the April Meeting about their work, and to coincide with the launch of a new logo.

6.4. Community Council Website


Mr Bain wanted ideas about what should go on the Community Council website or what should be changed or taken out. He has a student to work on the site as a project for their course.

7. From Committees
7.1. Recreation Committee
7.1.1. Xmas Tea
Mr Crichton reported that 160 plus local people attended and enjoyed the event. Ms Smith urged more Councillors to become involved as she had done and had enjoyed the event. Cllr Sangster also congratulated Mr Crichton.

7.1.2. Beautiful Scotland


Mr Crichton has received information on this year's event and is circulating information to committee members. He described some of the changes in this year's event. There is now more emphasis on ecological issues, apart from the usual categories.

7.1.3. New Year Ceilidh Report


Mr Crichton reported that the ceilidh was a sell-out and everything went very well. The raffle made 461, which with a top up to 500 was given as a donation to the Cosmos Centre. The local Masonic Lodge who ran the bar made around 750. 250 was donated to the St Davids Centre, 250 to the Boys Brigade and 250 to the Youth Trust.

7.1.4. Veteran Sports Person of the Year


Mr Crichton reported that following agreement to sponsor an award through the local NE Fife

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Sports Organisation there had been an expectation that it would be an award for a sports person with a disability. However the award to be sponsored is for the Veteran Sports Person. A trophy has been suggested as a more long lasting way to spend our donation.

7.2. General Purposes


No recent meeting

7.3. 200 Club


7.3.1. General Report
Mr Reed reported that at the present time the 200 Club has 94 members. He plans to try and increase this membership by publicity in the local press. He also informed the Community Council that there is a considerable balance in the 200 Club account at this time. If membership is increased, prize money can be increased. The 200 Club also propose giving an award of 200 to the Cosmos Centre for their bus appeal. Mr Fett offered to co-operate on promoting the Club. Ms Smith commented on the need to draw up guidelines on awards, partly with a view to ensuring that awards made to groups etc are spent properly. Cllr Sangster added that the 200 Club should receive thank you letters from recipients of awards.

7.3.2. Club Draw


1st Prize: Mr G.M. Paterson, 2nd prize Mr T. D. Foster 3rd prize Mr Joe Peterson

7.4. Health, Education & Welfare Committee


7.4.1. School Partnerships
Ms Smith reported that the committee had had a meeting and the idea of school partnerships had been the main issue of discussion - see 8.6.

7.4.2. St Andrews Young Citizen of the Year


Mr Bain reported that there had been an applicant for this award and he hoped that more might be forthcoming.

8. New Business
8.1. Chinese Music Concert Funding
See presentation for details

8.2. Community Council Seminar - 10th May 2008


For information

8.3. St Andrews Conservation Area Appraisal And Management Plan


Dr Goudie thought that it was unsatisfactory that the St Andrews Preservation Trust should be the main body approached for consultation, and suggested that a representative of the Planning Committee should contact the consultants/officials on the matter. Dr Goudie to discuss with Planning Committee and organise a letter to the appropriate official on this matter.

8.4. St Andrews Community Hospital & Health Centre Travel Planning GroupInaugural Meeting - 7th February 2008
For information. Interested members to attend the public meeting.

8.5. Request for new community notice board outside SPAR in Tom Morris Drive
Dealt with under planning committee

8.6. School Partnerships


Ms Smith commented that in this venture she is trying to formalise the work she thinks the Community Council should be doing with schools. Canongate has been chosen as the first school, mainly because it is first in the list alphabetically! She hoped that the idea would roll out to other schools and that other Community Councillors would become associated with local primary schools. Ms Smith will be the named Community Councillor for Canongate Primary School.

8.7. St Andrews in Focus - Financial Assistance Request


Ms Selwyn had written to Ms Smith asking for financial assistance of around 700 per issue to

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assist with distribution. Mr Crichton commented that the idea of financial support had been discussed at a previous GP meeting where it had been agreed that support for a commercial venture was inappropriate, but that the Community Council would pay for _ a page that would be the Chairman's half page. Ms Smith asked for member's views on the request. Mr Marks proposed keeping financial assistance at the same level of 130 per issue, Mr Crichton seconded the proposal. A majority agreed with the proposal.

8.8. St Andrews World Class Initiative


For information. Dr Goudie thought that the Community Council ought to be involved, if only to remind St Andrews World Class that the Community Council is the representative body for local issues, whereas World Class in his view represents a narrower view primarily concerned with tourism. Mr Fraser volunteered his services but would welcome guidance from members as to what he should say. Mr Marks commented that Mr Finlay had also expressed an interest in attending World Class meetings should perhaps should liaise with Mr Fraser on this meeting. Cllr Sangster encouraged involvement of the Community Council in this consultation.

9. Reports from Office Bearers


9.1. Chair
9.1.1. Chairman's Report
Ms Smith appealed to Community Councillors to get themselves on to committees, reminding them that the bulk of work would be done there and not in the main meeting. Ms Smith suggested that members should contact herself or the secretary, Mr Marks for further information about committee attendance/membership. Mr Marks also briefly commented on the meeting schedule of the 4 main committees. Cllr Sangster added the Coat of Arms Sub Committee to the list and briefly outlined it's function and membership. Also see items under Reports from Representatives.

9.2. Treasurer
9.2.1. Investment of Community Council Funds
The treasurer is going to investigate an appropriate high interest account/s in which to put Community Council money that isn't required for daily running costs etc.

9.3. Secretary
9.3.1. See correspondence

10. Any Other Competent Business


10.1. Quiz Night for St Andrews Preservation Trust
Mrs Denyer advertised this fundraising event for the Preservation Trust, which is to take place on the 28th February at the New Links Club

10.2. Date of the March Meeting 03/03/08

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